LT 21 - first 2.2 based game (16/30)
Sun, 06/27/2010 - 17:47 — maho-admin
LT 21 is going to start. First big game with freeciv 2.2 used.
Game is teamless by default, but poll is in progress, so form teams just in case.
Deadlines:
- 2010-07-03: creating poll deadline
- 2010-07-17: last poll is voted, team forming deadline (see what will happend if teams are not formed)
- 2010-07-18 or later: game start
Comments
removed
I will remove.
removed
re: re: idlers
I thought that we have such way. We just remove them (from time to time ;) ).
Okay - I propose that all idlers are removed within 3 turns, unless their team mates find a substitute immediately.
It's not written in rules, but so far I remove idlers when I notice them (and I'm not lazy ;) ), or when someone demands it.
Idlers with over 15 turns of not connecting are:
- skywalker
- edysun
- lohoris
- zodrac
- joris_k
- Cabralzhinho Auge
I will remove.
automated
I favour an automated response. It requires a patch so I don't expect it in main games any time soon.
We had such option in 2.1 game (not ported to 2.2) and ... it's not good thing IMO :).
Sometimes idling has more complex nature, and it should be reviewed by someone.
re: idlers
I thought that we have such way. We just remove them (from time to time ;) ).
Okay - I propose that all idlers are removed within 3 turns, unless their team mates find a substitute immediately.
Idlers with over 15 turns of not connecting are:
- skywalker
- edysun
- lohoris
- zodrac
- joris_k
- Cabralzhinho Auge
We just remove them (from time to time ;) ).
Inconsistency in removing idlers is a significant negative factor in recent games.
I favour an automated response. It requires a patch so I don't expect it in main games any time soon.
re: idle takeover
I disagree.
We have no chances to win anyways, even if we take Joris, so there is no profit from making the mess ...
Until we figure out a good, consistent way to deal with idlers
I thought that we have such way. We just remove them (from time to time ;) ).
idler takeover
Why don't we try to set up a system of idle takeover players and a substitution bench again? It worked well for many games. If anyone wants to take over Joris-K and their teammates don't disagree then I see no reason not to do that.
Until we figure out a good, consistent way to deal with idlers we could allow the teammates of Joris to manage his account for now, I wouldnt mind.
Arguments like "having an idler in your team is your own fault, you chose him" make some sense, but the problem is that there's no way to assess new players. If they have no game record then it's a gamble. If having an idler in your team ruins you people wont be willing to give new players a chance, which hurts the game and community.
=== 0h Marduk, thou art chiefest among the great gods! To destroy and to create; speak thou the word, and thy command shall be fulfilled. ===
Joris_k has really stuffed
Joris_k has really stuffed up Dude&Maho's team. Idling in a team game is not cool. I won't mind if his nation gets delegated to one of his teammates...
Client bug
- I don't have embassy with 2 of my team ("With us"). I have embassy with the other member of my team ("Both"). Sometimes I can open meeting window; sometimes I cannot open a meeting window.
This embassy problem is bug #16457 in your Freeciv client. The bug report suggests that the bug only happens during the turn when you connect to the game. Longturn players like to disconnect and connect every day, so this bug happens more often.
The only way to fix this bug is to compile your own Freeciv with the patch, or to wait until Freeciv 2.2.3. Everyone who use Freeciv 2.2.2 will continue to have embassy problems until they upgrade their clients.
@mr
It should solve problem with idlers, they would just die ;)
Once it gets to 10 turns idle they get marked as idle, then somebody clicks a button??
Somebody clicks the button. Note - that only when someone claims that someone is idler. No reason to mark as idler someone, if it doesn't disturb to players.
@dude
No, it's team responsibility to get appropriate teammates. If they get bad guy to team, then it's their problem.
Can we have a reliability meter? Do you have information about delegation and idlers?
Of course I have. You have it too. Look at subscribers tab of each game (at least later than LT13)
reliability meter
No, it's team responsibility to get appropriate teammates. If they get bad guy to team, then it's their problem.
Can we have a reliability meter? Do you have information about delegation and idlers?
You know, if there were a working longturn svn server we could do this automatically...
ideas
It should solve problem with idlers, they would just die ;)
Once it gets to 10 turns idle they get marked as idle, then somebody clicks a button??
@dude
yeah, but it would hurt the team. an idler should be taken by a teammate.
No, it's team responsibility to get appropriate teammates. If they get bad guy to team, then it's their problem.
In this case - our.
Not yet.
should hurt
yeah, but it would hurt the team. an idler should be taken by a teammate.
is the repository server ready? perhaps we can just write a patch to distribute the idlers cities to his teammates
I don't think there should be any benefit to having an idler in the team, like getting his cities. Rather, it should hurt. Part of the team creation process is to create a good team with no idlers.
Quote:It should solve
yeah, but it would hurt the team. an idler should be taken by a teammate.
is the repository server ready? perhaps we can just write a patch to distribute the idlers cities to his teammates
Consistent handling of Idlers
I would very much welcome an automatic server response to the problem of idle players.
re: other idlers
An idea - maybe implement something like slow killing units when someone is idling (more than X turns, let's say 3)? Exactly like with killing unhomecitied units?
It should solve problem with idlers, they would just die ;)
other idlers
I'm afraid that he should be just removed from game. It's sad - as he is my teammate too.
Please also sort out/monitor these potential idlers:
3 turns - skywalker
7 turns - edysun, lohoris, zodrac
10 turns - joris_k,
11 turns - CAbRa ...
Joris_K
I'm afraid that he should be just removed from game. It's sad - as he is my teammate too.
Taking control over an allied nation
Joris_K turned out to be a pussy and started idling when he was attacked. Unfortunately, he's my team-mate. He has been idling for 10 turns. I'm not sure what the rules say, would anybody mind if i took over his nation?
Same things are in LTeX, i
Same things are in LTeX, i had embassy with detor but sometime was with me and sometimes was both.
Quote:But dude is
Are your embassies related to fact fi player name is "Unassigned" or not?
Not for our team. We don't have any delegation active. I think this has happened since the start of the game. Maybe you can quickly make a dummy game in see if this happens for some teams?
re: embassy
Interesting.
I have the same. Everyone has embassy "both" in my team, but Dude has "with me". So he can launch report, I can't.
But dude is "Unassigned" (delegation).
Are your embassies related to fact fi player name is "Unassigned" or not?
I/we have the same problem.
I/we have the same problem. It usually looks like (from my perspective anyway) I don't have an embassy with team member ste. Some turns everything looks right.
Bugs with embassy!
I am in the team with mrsynical
I do not have an embassy with him. But he sees that I do. He has an embassy with me but sees that he doesn't. I can open diplomatic meetings without an embassy but cannot do intelligence reports.
Bugs with embassy?
Hi,
Do other teams have embassy problems?
- I don't have embassy with 2 of my team ("With us"). I have embassy with the other member of my team ("Both"). Sometimes I can open meeting window; sometimes I cannot open a meeting window.
can I play ?
can I play ?
something.
Please post something when it's OK.
something.
I have applied this patch
I have applied this patch without testing on LteX. I think I can trust that it won't make any harm.
no luck of course. Taking
no luck of course. Taking with quotes shouldn't work, because 'mrsynical' gave you delegation, not '"mrsynical"'.
Anyway - it should work now.
Quote:I will try to fix it
today is very elastic term ;). However - I have finally fixed it. No workers progress is lost (I hope)
can't /take
Any news ?
I should play Marduk's for 3 days and i can't take his account.
Please post something when it's OK.
new patches need to be tested first.
I am against adding new patches to an active game.
I want all new patches to be tested in the experimental game first.
thanks - but doesn't work
/take 'mrsynical'
/take: Sorry, one can't take human players in this game.
/take \"mrsynical\"
/take: No player by the name of '\"mrsynical\"'.
or try take \"mrsynical\"
or try take \"mrsynical\"
/take: No player by the name
/take: No player by the name of 'mrsynicat'
It said name in apostrophes so try 'mrsynical'
checking with quotes
I tried to take delegation with quotes added - no luck
when a player name exists
/take "mrsynical" gives the same error as /take mrsynical
/take: Sorry, one can't take human players in this game.
if the player name is not recognized
/take "mrsynicat" and /take mrsynicat give the same error message
/take: No player by the name of 'mrsynicat'.
can you wait another turn
can you wait another turn with this?
also, kernigh sent a patch to preserve worker progress, you definitely need to apply it!
Quote: I am trying to take
I am trying to take Mrsynical's account. But fail.
The error message is
/take: Sorry, one can't take human players in this game.
it's probably because our nicknames are in '"' quotes. I will try to fix it today, however it will require server restart. Workers progress will lost.
Is delegation working?
I am trying to take Mrsynical's account. But fail.
The error message is
/take: Sorry, one can't take human players in this game.
Duncan also saw this error at the start of LT20. Is delegation working?
Quote:Aaaaahhhhh... it seems
Marduk sent (all?) participants emails saying the game has started... Isn't he in your team ;-)
Quote:I could not find any
Subscribe to http://www.longturn.org/pgfeed... or http://www.longturn.org/pgfeed... to avoid such surprizes in future ;).
LT21 started ?
Aaaaahhhhh... it seems the only link to this article is on the home page -I never get there.
I could not find any other link on the forum, especially on the LT21 page (where goes my link to the forum).
That would be nice to have one there.
Sorry to be that annoying ;)
Quote:If so, the first turn
What about "LT 21 started"?
hello mighty maho
LT21 is running and i think i have missed the first turn.
We 're at T1 and i already see an irrigated tile : Is game starting at T0 ?
If so, the first turn has only lasted 24 hours, and i saw no game announcement on the forum.
You are tough with us... what about 2 days at T0 again ?
2.2.0 vs. 2.2.1
In Debian testing is still 2.2.0. A version with 0? I don't know ...
The 50 bugfixes in 2.2.1 convinced me to install 2.2.1 from unstable. And hey, I survived my first moves! :-)
Teams resolved - ilist of removed players
Time to resolve teams - we have 2 conflicting teams:
- cabralzinho auge + lohoris and
- woj11+lohoris
and unteamed: urgo, turendu, sioux
According to rules - Urgo, Turendu and Sioux are removed.
Also, to resolve conflict - I need to remove one player. All (Cabralzihho Auge, Lohoris and Woj11) meet condition removal of which will make 2 or more teams conflict resolved, but removing of Lohoris would break any of the teams. So Lohoris won't be removed, I have to choose from Woj11 and Cabral....
Woj11 is obverse, Cabral... is reverse. I throw the coin - obverse. So sorry Woj11 - I need to remove you, as you wasn't able to create proper team. I hope we will see in next game.
./configure && make as root?
./configure && make as root? bueeh.
And it doesn't save your hdd space when you remove sources tree, then binaries take only a bit ...
And time ... you cannot use alt-f2 in your scenario. You cannot link /usr/src/freeciv22/civ to your menu/desktop/whatever ....
The advantage of my solution
The advantage of my solution is that I didn't have to compile. When LT20 has finished I will install the .deb anyway.
thx for everybody, I can
thx for everybody,
I can install it in Ubuntu and it works :)
Quote: Way more convenient
Way more convenient is to cd /usr/src/freeciv22 -> ./configure && make
( skip install at all ) and use /usr/src/freeciv22/civ
( then you saved your hdd space and some time :) )
Quote: I extracted the
I extracted the client from the package and copied it to /usr/games/.
Way more convenient is to ./configure --prefix=/opt/freeciv2.2 && make && sudo make install , and use /opt/freeciv2.2/bin/freeciv-client-gtk
http://packages.debian.org/sq
http://packages.debian.org/squ...
http://packages.debian.org/sid...
Haven't tested it, probably you cannot install it to ubuntu,other debian without trouble.
Nice sites. I wonder how I
Nice sites. I wonder how I missed playdeb so long.
But not all is good. ATM I have 2.0.10 warclient, 2.2.0 from playdeb and 2.2.99 trunk. "Of course" none of those clients connects to the 2.1.8 lt20 server.
I wish I could kick one of the freeciv developers' ass for not putting client backward compatibility on their priority list.
Our team is almost complete,
Our team is almost complete, if Elrik cancels his invite to Lohoris then we have a 4 player team without any conflicts (Elrik, Sokrat, FCAS, Marduk). Don't kick us please :)
=== 0h Marduk, thou art chiefest among the great gods! To destroy and to create; speak thou the word, and thy command shall be fulfilled. ===
ok
No problem.
deb
ubuntu 10.04 or earlier
http://www.playdeb.net/updates...
debian
http://packages.debian.org/tes...
+ freeciv-data and pray to have all dependencies
if not, prepare for bigger upgrade or get sources and compile using apt-kung-fu :)
Search in unstable
It has already entered the unstable branch. If you don't want to upgrade your installation to unstable, use pinning or install the package manually with dpkg.
BTW: to be able to use 2.1 and 2.2 simultaneously, I extracted the client from the package and copied it to /usr/games/. Perhaps you have to change the name in order not to overwrite the V2.1. (In the case of the gtk client it's already different).
Then I extracted the data package and copied the content to /usr/share/games/freeciv22.
Now I can start the new client with
FREECIV_PATH=/usr/share/games/freeciv22 /usr/games/freeciv-gtk2
What still hurts is that the engels tileset isn't available for 2.2.
2.2 version
Does anyone know when I can get deb package for 2.2 version?
Quote:The question is: can
I see no reason to postpone this game. We will have lt22 or maybe even lt23 in September.
This is not the last LT game ever ;).
holiday time
Hi all. Maho, I have an ideea, maybe it is a good one. :) It' a period of time when a part of us plan to go in holidays. In my case (and my team Zodrac&Edysun), we refused some players with us because we are not at home 1-2 weeks in august. I see others in the same case. The question is: can we all agreed to start this games somewhere in September? Or I ask too much? :)
Quote:If we start today we
You had 2 weeks.
Oops, almost forgot about
Oops, almost forgot about this ;) I've accepted a number of invitations, hopefully we can still create a team together.
Maho, there's a trade-off between how much time we lose (postponed start) and how many players we lose. If we start today we would lose lots of players, so it seems more efficient to give team formation another day or 2 to finish.
=== 0h Marduk, thou art chiefest among the great gods! To destroy and to create; speak thou the word, and thy command shall be fulfilled. ===
Quote: Tomorrow is the
Tomorrow is the deadline... but at what time ?
12pm (i.e. 18/07/10 at 0am) ?
Honestly - I don't know. It depends on many factor (eg. wife, weather, mood), but *probably* near evening.
OK, that's not what is written there, but i don't see why removing players with conflicts or without team.
with conflicts - because it's the only convenient way of resolving conflicts I know so far,
Could be interesting... Think of Switzerland or Sweden !
Well, I think they have no chance :).
deadline at ?
Tomorrow is the deadline... but at what time ?
12pm (i.e. 18/07/10 at 0am) ?
OK, that's not what is written there, but i don't see why removing players with conflicts or without team.
Why can't they play the game alone ?
Could be interesting... Think of Switzerland or Sweden !
Anyone wants me as a
Anyone wants me as a teammate??:) Common people i am not that bad:) If some team accept me i will cancel the rest invitations to solve problems.
resolved
Well, i hope it is resolved, it didn't came to my mind there could be a four player team. :(
I hope all things go well since there is no longer a conflicting team concerning me.
Untill the year -4000 is it then i guess.
Joris
I will be happy to play with
I will be happy to play with you, however it's your duty to convince rest of my teammates to accept you too. If not - I will cancel my invitation tomorrow (as tomorrow is deadline of team forming, and I don't want to remove myself according to team conflicts resolving algorithm).
teams...
are a bit too confused for me.
Some guys seem to be on holidays. Many new players i don't know...
So anyone feel free to invite me -you won't have to tell me what to play ;)
oh no...
What have I done ?
...I signed in again.
I'm gonna have to hide this from my wife again...
Quote:if you cannot make a
Who said that I want remove someone because of team size? I wanted remove because teams were conflicting (there were 2 concurrent teams until you accepted Joris_K as teammate).
it makes no sense to remove
it makes no sense to remove joris_k, he voted in favor. if you cannot make a four player team then i'm willing to remove myself.
Team conflicts resolving - first estimation
If deadline of team forming was today, I would do following steps to resolve conflicts between teams:
- remove Marduk, elrik, Zodrac, turendu, FCAS, Sioux, TBH
- remove CAbRaLzinhO Auge to resolve conflict between CAbRaLzinhO Auge+Lohoris and Lohoris+woj11
- to resolve conflict between maho+septem+Joris_K and dude+maho+septem I could remove either Joris_K or dude. Probably I would use coin to decide.
As a result we would have following teams:
- duncan+mrsyn+kevin
- edysun+skywalker
- ste+hades+bli+det0r
either:
- maho+septem+joris
or
- maho+septem+dude
max team size=15
max team size=15
I turned teams on
I have turned teams on, in case teams poll will pass.
Post to make this page
Post to make this page "active".